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Huna prayer, Max, Serge and the subtle differences


Dear sisters and brothers,

I've finally found my way to Huna, and I feel great. I come from the
chaos magick school and, after a couple of years, felt lost somehow. Huna found me when I really needed it emoticon

I've already had success using a technique Serge King wrote about.
I read MFL's books, and I just finished King's "Mastering your hidden self". Both authors teach pretty similar things, but one thing is strikingly different:

a) MFL, Otha Wingo and others say that in the Ha prayer, you have to send mana to your High Self to help it materialize the prayer.

b) King says you have to (super)charge mana, but not for the High Self
(which is directly connected to God and has endless power). King says mana-charging helps your unihipili to stabilize and empower desired thought forms.

My personal working theory is that, according to the second principle (Kala -- there are no limits), everything is connected to everything. So, if I and my uni build up mana and send it to my aumakua, I also send power to my uni and me. Does this sound strange? To me, it makes perfect sense emoticon

What's your feeling about this?

Aloha,
emoticon
Norbert
Apr/10/2007, 9:53 am Link to this post Send Email to norbertgmatausch   Send PM to norbertgmatausch
 
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Re: Huna prayer, Max, Serge and the subtle differences


As you say, that makes perfect sense.

ad a] They say you do so through your low self. (Some said that if you have direct connection to your high self, you can send it directly to high self.)

---
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Re: Huna prayer, Max, Serge and the subtle differences


quote:

norbertgmatausch wrote:

Dear sisters and brothers,

I've finally found my way to Huna, and I feel great. I come from the
chaos magick school and, after a couple of years, felt lost somehow. Huna found me when I really needed it emoticon

I've already had success using a technique Serge King wrote about.
I read MFL's books, and I just finished King's "Mastering your hidden self". Both authors teach pretty similar things, but one thing is strikingly different:

a) MFL, Otha Wingo and others say that in the Ha prayer, you have to send mana to your High Self to help it materialize the prayer.

b) King says you have to (super)charge mana, but not for the High Self
(which is directly connected to God and has endless power). King says mana-charging helps your unihipili to stabilize and empower desired thought forms.

My personal working theory is that, according to the second principle (Kala -- there are no limits), everything is connected to everything. So, if I and my uni build up mana and send it to my aumakua, I also send power to my uni and me. Does this sound strange? To me, it makes perfect sense emoticon

What's your feeling about this?

Aloha,
emoticon
Norbert




Aloha Norbert,

Unfortunately, Two Bears is away at the moment, otherwise I'm sure he would happily give you a detailed and informative answer to your question.

Now, what you will soon realise is that there are MANY different traditions within Huna.

Understand that Huna is not the religion or the spiritual path as practiced by the Ancient Hawaiians. In a nutshell, elements of Huna are Hawaiian but, as a whole, Huna was based on Max Freedom long's western INTERPRETATION of what he observed, and discovered.

There has been much experimentation and such, with the techniques, thus giving birth to the various traditions. The important thing is whether or not the technique works for you.

I am a fan of Serge King's work (incidently, Two Bears is not for reasons you can find on the main page). However, Serge's ideas, including the seven principle's are technically not Huna, in the sense that they did come directly from MFL. However, I believe they are just as valid in the sense that they are a good interpretation of the concepts that form what we call 'Huna'.

I think I understand what you are talking about but the general teaching is this: There is no direct link between the Uhane and the Aumakua. Only the Unihipili can allow the mana to be sent to the Aumakua and it will not do this if there are blockages (such as fixations) in the cord.


I can understand how confusing it can be when you so much contradicting information. I think the key is just to experiment. Keep reading, keep researching, keep trying!

I am currently taking an 8 week course with the Huna Institute, which is owned by Kahuna Lani (a student of MFL's who owned a healing clinic for many years and has lived an AMAZING life!). Let me tell you, this course (which is designed to make you the kind of person who has their prayers answered) has blown many things I thought I knew about Huna, straight out of the water!

Kahuna Lani can be contacted at lani@hunainstitute.org. He is a very kind man and would be more than happy to answer any questions you have.

When Two Bears is better and with us again, he will also answer any questions you may have. I have exchanged about 40 emails with him and have learned so much, for which I am very grateful.

Many of the Huna authors (Charlotte Berney for one) will be more than happy to talk to you, too.

There is a wealth of information available to you, its just a case of finding what particular methods suit you. I have no doubt that Kahuna Two Bears' way is just as valid as James Venable Alexander's or Kahuna Lani's.

Like you, I'm still trying to find my way, but am eternally grateful for having people such as those mentioned to guide me, and offer me different ideas and viewpoints.

Welcome to the board my friend :-)

Many blessings,

Craig
Apr/13/2007, 5:21 am Link to this post Send Email to The Abyss   Send PM to The Abyss
 
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Re: Huna prayer, Max, Serge and the subtle differences


quote:

Dear sisters and brothers,



Aloha, and welcome Norbert.

quote:

I've finally found my way to Huna, and I feel great. I come from the
chaos magick school and, after a couple of years, felt lost somehow. Huna found me when I really needed it emoticon



Welcome to the family. ;-)

I also studied Chaos magick abit AFTER finding the path of Hawai'ian mysticism (sometimes called Huna. Chaos magick did not asnswer my spiritual questions; so I went back to Hawai'ian mysticism.


I prefer to call this path Pule me mana (pray with lifeforce energy) because it is a more accurate description than Huna. I only use the name huna on my website and reviews so the readers of MFL, Serge Kahili King, Tad James, and others will know what I am talking about.

quote:

I've already had success using a technique Serge King wrote about.
I read MFL's books, and I just finished King's "Mastering your hidden self". Both authors teach pretty similar things, but one thing is strikingly different:



If you like the technique, and you are getting results; that is all that really matters doesn't it?

To be honest I have real issues with both authors.

MFL putting huna in a Christrian description, and adding bits of theosophy to it.

Serge Kahili King for making new names for the three selves, and adding a lot of new age material to Hawai'ian mysticism. Kane, Ku, and Lono are three of the Hawai'ian gods.

In 1999 Anahato (a friend in Germany) recommend that I study huna after I became a Reiki master. I read "Hawaiian Religion And Magic" Scott Cunnungham. He was Wiccan and was into worshiping the Akua I was not interested in this; so I read Max Freedom Long. He added Christianity to it, and again I was turned off of huna; so I wrote Anahato and my reply was "Not only no! but hell No!!" about studying huna.

About 15 months later 1n October 2000 I had two mystical experiences that directed me back to this path. This time I read "Fundamentals Of Hawaiian Mysticism" Charlotte Berney, and liked it, and in the back she tells her readers that her teachers Jack and Josephine Gray were advanced students of Dr. Clark Wilkerson" I bought a copy of "Hawaiian magic" by Dr Wilkerson, and it changed my life!

I use the names of 'aumakua, uhane, and unihipili for the three selves. I use those names because Ifound a magaxine that was printed in 1898 (20 years before MFL went to the islands. This magazine was published in Honolulu, and there was an article by a kahuna. I bought the magazine on eBay.

quote:

a) MFL, Otha Wingo and others say that in the Ha prayer, you have to send mana to your High Self to help it materialize the prayer.

b) King says you have to (super)charge mana, but not for the High Self
(which is directly connected to God and has endless power). King says mana-charging helps your unihipili to stabilize and empower desired thought forms.



I always send the mana to my 'aumakua.

quote:

My personal working theory is that, according to the second principle (Kala -- there are no limits), everything is connected to everything. So, if I and my uni build up mana and send it to my aumakua, I also send power to my uni and me. Does this sound strange? To me, it makes perfect sense emoticon



You are right in many regards.

1. There ARE no limits. Only self imposed limits.

2. Everything IS connected.

3. When the 'aumakua gets the mana surcharge; the 'aumakua converts the mana into mana loa, and DOES indeed return part of the mana to us.

quote:

What's your feeling about this?



Norbert it sounds as if you have a good understanding of how this works.

---
Aloha. Rev. Two Bears

"I hope you know this violates my warranty"Twiki
May/7/2007, 5:40 am Link to this post Send Email to Two Bears   Send PM to Two Bears
 
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Re: Huna prayer, Max, Serge and the subtle differences


quote:

ad a] They say you do so through your low self. (Some said that if you have direct connection to your high self, you can send it directly to high self.)



The answer is yes and no.

Yes as you work with your 'aumakua' you to set up a third aka cord from the uhane to the 'aumakua, and you can exchange information. But prayers MUST go through the unihipili (low self) because the low self is the one that generates the mana to bring the prayer into manifestation.

---
Aloha. Rev. Two Bears

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Re: Huna prayer, Max, Serge and the subtle differences


quote:

Unfortunately, Two Bears is away at the moment, otherwise I'm sure he would happily give you a detailed and informative answer to your question.



Well I have had all of the procedures completed, and am waiting for my partial plate to be made. So I am at a friends place and have decent access to a computer again.

After the partial plate comes back and is properly fitted; I will be going home in a week or so after that.

quote:

Now, what you will soon realise is that there are MANY different traditions within Huna.



Absolutely. There were also differences in old Hawaii.

quote:

Understand that Huna is not the religion or the spiritual path as practiced by the Ancient Hawaiians. In a nutshell, elements of Huna are Hawaiian but, as a whole, Huna was based on Max Freedom long's western INTERPRETATION of what he observed, and discovered.
quote:



Absolutely correct! Max Freedom Long was a sincere researcherl but he added a lot of things because he was working with a flawed translation of the bible in Hawai'ian, and a dictionary that was 70 years out of date.

quote:

There has been much experimentation and such, with the techniques, thus giving birth to the various traditions. The important thing is whether or not the technique works for you.



Absolutely correct again. My problem with Serge Kahili King adds new age material, parts of Qigong, and calls it all huna or Hawai'ian when it it NOT. I also don't like the fact that he calls the three selves kane, ku, and lono. Kane, Ku and Loono are three hawai'ian gods.

quote:

I am a fan of Serge King's work (incidently, Two Bears is not for reasons you can find on the main page). However, Serge's ideas, including the seven principle's are technically not Huna, in the sense that they did come directly from MFL. However, I believe they are just as valid in the sense that they are a good interpretation of the concepts that form what we call 'Huna'.



The good think about this group is that we can agree to disagree without becoming disagreeable.

quote:

I think I understand what you are talking about but the general teaching is this: There is no direct link between the Uhane and the Aumakua. Only the Unihipili can allow the mana to be sent to the Aumakua and it will not do this if there are blockages (such as fixations) in the cord.



There is no cord between the uhane and 'aumakua; but as we work with our 'aumakua; a third cord is set up. However prayers MUST go through the unihipili because the unihipili is the one that makes the mana surcharge to be sent up to the 'aumakua.

quote:

I am currently taking an 8 week course with the Huna Institute, which is owned by Kahuna Lani (a student of MFL's who owned a healing clinic for many years and has lived an AMAZING life!). Let me tell you, this course (which is designed to make you the kind of person who has their prayers answered) has blown many things I thought I knew about Huna, straight out of the water!



Sounds interesting. Do you recommend the course to others?

I know kahuna Lani via many exchanges in public and and E-Mails. I always thought he was too locked into the faulty model by MFL.

quote:

When Two Bears is better and with us again, he will also answer any questions you may have. I have exchanged about 40 emails with him and have learned so much, for which I am very grateful.



I am better, and have consistent access to a computer for a few days.

Craig; It was mu pleasure to be of help.

quote:

Many of the Huna authors (Charlotte Berney for one) will be more than happy to talk to you, too.



She is an awesome lady.

quote:

There is a wealth of information available to you, its just a case of finding what particular methods suit you. I have no doubt that Kahuna Two Bears' way is just as valid as James Venable Alexander's or Kahuna Lani's.
quote:



I know many huna authors, and have several of their books autographed to me.

I don't call what I do Huna in person. I call it pule me mana I just use the name huna on my website so people will have a frame of reference what I am talking about.

I am NOT going to make something up and call it Hawai'ian when it is NOT. I continue to work to find confirmation that what I teach to be Hawai'ian IS hawai'ian.

quote:

Like you, I'm still trying to find my way, but am eternally grateful for having people such as those mentioned to guide me, and offer me different ideas and viewpoints.
quote:



This path answered my spiritual questions, and I wrote the material on the website, and my blog at Yahoo360 to assist others if this path answers their spiritual questions. If this path does not answer your spiritual questions; I hope that you will continue looking for your answers until you find a path that DOES answer your questions.

quote:

Welcome to the board my friend :-)
quote:



Yep. All are welcome, and we do not all have to agree.

---
Aloha. Rev. Two Bears

"I hope you know this violates my warranty"Twiki
May/7/2007, 6:18 am Link to this post Send Email to Two Bears   Send PM to Two Bears
 
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Re: Huna prayer, Max, Serge and the subtle differences


Aloha my friends,

I've had to re-sign up due to my password no longer working, and I could not get a new one sent to my email address as I closed the email accoutn I originally registered with. (This is the_abyss by the way! :P)

quote:

Two Bears wrote:

Well I have had all of the procedures completed, and am waiting for my partial plate to be made. So I am at a friends place and have decent access to a computer again.

After the partial plate comes back and is properly fitted; I will be going home in a week or so after that.



I wish you all the best with that Two Bears. Your presence here has been missed.




quote:

The good think about this group is that we can agree to disagree without becoming disagreeable.



Absolutely. Its a shame more people cannot have that attitude but such is life :-)



quote:

There is no cord between the uhane and 'aumakua; but as we work with our 'aumakua; a third cord is set up. However prayers MUST go through the unihipili because the unihipili is the one that makes the mana surcharge to be sent up to the 'aumakua.



Hmmm...yes I've heard you mention this a couple of times Two Bears and I'm still open minded about it, but I have to wonder, what can actually be gained from this 'new' cord if the prayers still have to go through the Unihipili?


quote:

Sounds interesting. Do you recommend the course to others?



Very much so. Just like that of Allen P. Lewis's book, the course is giving you a step-by-step path to making your prayers answered.

It is a lot of work, and they do approach Huna as a religion, which many people would find difficult, but I can honestly say I finally feel like I'm getting somewhere now, and may even consider joining the Huna Heiau.

quote:

I know kahuna Lani via many exchanges in public and and E-Mails. I always thought he was too locked into the faulty model by MFL.



Kahuna Lani has took things so much further than MFL, rejecting some aspects as presented by MFL, but developing a lot of things so that they have become more effective.

What particular things are you referring to, Two Bears?

If we were to believe some of the stories that Kahuna Lani has told me, and I for one have been given a lot of reasons to believe them, then he is certainly doing something right.

That said, and I think you will agree Two Bears, there seems to be more than one way to reach a given goal (e.g. healing) when it comes to this stuff.

quote:

I am better, and have consistent access to a computer for a few days.

Craig; It was my pleasure to be of help.



Aloha nui loa to you, my friend.



quote:

This path answered my spiritual questions, and I wrote the material on the website, and my blog at Yahoo360 to assist others if this path answers their spiritual questions. If this path does not answer your spiritual questions; I hope that you will continue looking for your answers until you find a path that DOES answer your questions.



Thus far, this one path has answered more of my spiritual questions in one year, than the multitude of paths I studied over 5 years has.

It just FEELS right.


Hope to hear from you again soon Two Bears.

Many blessings,

Craig




May/12/2007, 12:44 pm Link to this post Send Email to Crags   Send PM to Crags
 
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Re: Huna prayer, Max, Serge and the subtle differences


quote:

Aloha my friends,



aloha.

FYI I am back home now. I returned homa May 30th at 1:30 AM.

quote:

I've had to re-sign up due to my password no longer working, and I could not get a new one sent to my email address as I closed the email accoutn I originally registered with. (This is the_abyss by the way! :P)



No worries. I kinda thought it was you. Glad you set up another account instead of leaving.

quote:

I wish you all the best with that Two Bears. Your presence here has been missed.



Thanks. It's good to be missed.

quote:

Absolutely. Its a shame more people cannot have that attitude but such is life :-)



Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and if their unihipili believes the technique will work; those techniques WILL work, no matter where the techniques come from.

I do the best I can to have the material I share as accurate to the Hawai'ian way as possible. That is why I read so much avout huna, Hawai'ian mysticism, society, and more importantly the legends and beliefs of the hawai'ian people.


quote:

Hmmm...yes I've heard you mention this a couple of times Two Bears and I'm still open minded about it, but I have to wonder, what can actually be gained from this 'new' cord if the prayers still have to go through the Unihipili?



There is a lot of wisdom and insight to be gained by building the third aka cord.

When the third aka cord is built up the 'aumakua can send you flashes of insight or inspiration for conclusions that you would likely never come up with.

The prayers MUST go through the unihipili because the unihipili is responsible for gathering the mana for the mana surcharge.

I will give you one such inspiration that happened to me. I had been meditating with Actualism meditation for years before hawai'ian mysticism saved my life, and my 'aumakua was already beginning to work through me.

In 1992 I got a virus on my computer, and to protect myself I had set up an anti-virus program to run in the autoexec.bat file. This program when run would take about three minutes.

I got tired of doing nothing for three minutes when I wanted to use my computer, but I also did not want to be unprotected.

One day an idea erupted in my mind that I have no idea where it come from except my 'aumakua. The idea was "for viruses to replicate; they MUST change something. so you could detect the viruses by detecting the change they made.

In Volume 6 Issue 100 of the Virus-L digest I told people how they could detect virtually any virus known or unknown with the following.

1. a .bat file.
2. LZH archive software (free ware)
3. NAB27.ZIP (share ware)
4. Timer.zip (free ware)
5. File Compare that comes with DOS

Step 1. when you have a known clean computer you use NAB to snatch copies of the MBR and boot sector

Step 2, find the programs that run most frequently because those will likely be the first to be infected.

step 3. archive the boot sector and MBR images with the files you use most often.

step 4.compare the two archives. If they were identical you were clean.

step 5 display the elapsed time it took to run.

Then my virus tecting procedure took less than 10 seconds to complete instead of the three minutes it had taken before.

If you had a fully stealthed virus that would temporarily disinfect the host file when the archive program then reinfected the host file after the file was closed. the timer would give it away because the elapsed time would take two or three additional seconds to run. When you have a procedure that takes around 6-7 seconds to run day after dat then all of a sudden takes 9 seconds to run; it WILL be noticible.

There was only one type of virus that my routine could not retect was path companion infectors, and they can not spread too easily in tthe wild. They would be a dead give away just by checking the directory of a diskette.

Since learning this path and clearing the junk out of my uni; those inspiration or peak moments have happened more often.

quote:

Very much so. Just like that of Allen P. Lewis's book, the course is giving you a step-by-step path to making your prayers answered.



Thanks for the tip and recommendation.

quote:

find difficult, but I can honestly say I finally feel like I'm getting somewhere now, and may even consider joining the Huna Heiau.
quote:



If that feels right for you and helps you; then do it.

quote:

What particular things are you referring to, Two Bears?
quote:



I pointed out most of the faults in MFL's material, and instead of him being open minded and saying I will look into it, or you're right, etc, he defended MFL's work blindly in our discussions.

quote:

have been given a lot of reasons to believe them, then he is certainly doing something right.
quote:



I have seen things that tell me that I am doing something right too. If I were to tell people some of the things I have seen happen; they would be calling the men with white lab coats.

quote:

That said, and I think you will agree Two Bears, there seems to be more than one way to reach a given goal (e.g. healing) when it comes to this stuff.
quote:



ABSOLUTELY! I have posted a talk I give in my workshops "What your unihipili believes to be true becomes true" in the huna instruction folder and on my blog.

I'm not saying what he does; does not work. I'm just saying it isn;t necessarily true hawai'ian mysticism.

MFL made several mistakes in his research.

1. using a Hawai'ian disctionary 70 years out of date.

2. using a flawed translation of the bible in Hawai'ian

3. adding bits of Christianity to Huna

4. adding bits of theosophy to huna

5. Reginald Stewart lied to MFL about learning huna from the Berbers.

6. The Hawai'ian people would not talk of spiritual matters with MFL for fear of persecution.

etc.

I am not saying that Lani is not sincere (I know he is),

I am not saying what he does does not work (I have heard several stories that it does.

All I am saying is that his claim to being true to the old ways of Hawai'i. He isn't because he has his foundation on the work of MFL, and his foundation is weak and has flaws. because of the mistakes MFL made.

MFL was a VERY sincere and dedicated researcher; but there were many factors working against him that kept him from accurately telling the old ways of Hawai'i.

quote:

Thus far, this one path has answered more of my spiritual questions in one year, than the multitude of paths I studied over 5 years has.



This path answered more of my spiritual questions than all of the other paths I explored put together.

quote:

It just FEELS right.



Hear hear!!!


---
Aloha. Rev. Two Bears

"I hope you know this violates my warranty"Twiki
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Re: Huna prayer, Max, Serge and the subtle differences


Does Lani claim to follow the old Hawaiian ways?
I didn't use to think so?
For one thing, he goes firmly in steps of MFL, particularly in religion of Huna, for another he kind of insists in distinguishing between huna as Hawaiian mysticism and Huna Research's huna, and Huna as a MFL's religion.

I too found Lani very sincere and dedicated man.
His way doesn't seem like a path I would follow (at the moment), but he has my respect.

---
Aloha, Tomas
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Re: Huna prayer, Max, Serge and the subtle differences


I only talked to Lani briefly. You are correct that he is too locked into following the steps of Max Freedom Long.

Life is too short to waste mana and time in fighting so I left his group and let him believe whatever he likes, and I will believe what answers MY spiritual questions.

---
Aloha. Rev. Two Bears

"I hope you know this violates my warranty"Twiki
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