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HUNA POLITICS


In my months of research on 'Huna' I am surprised to find that I have not noticed the politics surrounding this system. Tonight my eyes were opened.

I came across a website today for masterworks international which, to my pleasant surprise, is based in the UK (great for me to see there are actually practicioners this side of the pond!).
On the website they have a bulletin board. Most of the posts there were by someone called Lani who I believe is assosciated with HRI and was taught by Max Freedom Long. Some of the things this person was discussing confused me. As I delved deeper I began to see there are some huge disagreements going on regarding Huna.

Much of it still confuses me, and I hope there may be someone here who knows more.

If you have a look at the Bulletin board on masterworks website you will soon see what I mean. There is so much talk about 'Hunian' language, Huna Mua, Ho'omana, cannibalism etc and none of it makes much sense to me.

Now please correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought Huna was Max Freedom Long's interpretation of the practices of the Kahuna Pule (possibly called ho'omana by the ancient Hawiians), and that many Hawaiians are offended by this 'system' because of the Christian influences added by MFL, and because they believed the knowledge should be kept more or less secret to prevent misuse.
I've even heard that native Hawaiians are claiming they practiced, nor believed ANYTHING outlined in the system we call 'Huna'.

For someone such as myself who has only been exposed to Huna for a matter of months, I am incredibly lost :-)

I would appreciate any light that can be shed on this.

Peace,

Craig
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Re: HUNA POLITICS


quote:

In my months of research on 'Huna' I am surprised to find that I have not noticed the politics surrounding this system. Tonight my eyes were opened.



Yes: There is a danger of politics raising it's ugly head when the idea of any field being fractured the way this spiritual technology has been.

Now you understand why I included "various traditions in huna in my website.

quote:

Most of the posts there were by someone called Lani who I believe is assosciated with HRI and was taught by Max Freedom Long. Some of the things this person was



I don't believe kahuna Lani is associated with HRI. MFL was Lani's friend and mentor.

quote:

discussing confused me. As I delved deeper I began to see there are some huge disagreements going on regarding Huna.



Yes; there are several camps; and followers of most camps are sure their perceptions are right, and their form of huna is correct.

Here is a brief list of some of the assorted camp's.

MFL, Serge Kahili King. David K Bray, etc.

quote:

Much of it still confuses me, and I hope there may be someone here who knows more.



;-)

quote:

There is so much talk about 'Hunian' language,
quote:



This is Kahuna Lani's pet project.

quote:

Ho'omana,



This is the only word the Hawai'ians had for religion. It means "to make mana".

quote:

Now please correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought Huna was Max Freedom Long's interpretation of the practices of the Kahuna Pule (possibly called ho'omana by the ancient Hawiians), and that many Hawaiians are offended by this 'system' because of the Christian influences added by MFL, and because they believed the knowledge should be kept more or less secret to prevent misuse.



The name huna was coined by Max Freedom Long )much the same way I coined the terms pule me mana (pray with lifeforce energy), or spiritual technology.

Then others such as David K. Bray, Tad James, Serge Kahili King, etc took the ball and ran with it. Then the assorted camps changed things, or added NLP, Qigong, etc TO huna, and continue to call it huna.

When I talk about the subject; I prefer to use the name pule me mana because that more accurately describes this spiritual technology.

I used the name huna on the website so the others that read MFL, Serge Kahili King, etc will have a frame of refrence to what I am talking about.

quote:

I've even heard that native Hawaiians are claiming they practiced, nor believed ANYTHING outlined in the system we call 'Huna'.



This is true.

The Hawai'ians NEVER claimed to be a lost tribe of Israel, Never claimed that Jesus was an initiated kahuna, They acknowledged E'O and the assorted akua (gods and goddesses)

Are you aware that in the later years before MFLs death in 1971 that Charles "Kali" Kenn (a living treasure of Hawai'i) joined the Huna Research Associates and tried to clue MFL into the areas of Hawai'ian spirituality that he was in error about; but MFL would not listen to him about the old ways. By then MFL was so immersed into his beliefs that Hawai'ians were a lost tribe of Israel, and Jesus was an initiated kahuna; they he would not listen.

quote:

For someone such as myself who has only been exposed to Huna for a matter of months, I am incredibly lost :-)



I could say "trust me" but I won't. I say "Trust yourself" research the Hawai'ian culture and legends. and test the methods for yourself, then use the ones that work; and discard the techniques that do not work.


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Re: HUNA POLITICS


Thankyou for your reply Two Bears.

The main thing that has confused me is that Lani is stating that MFL invented the 'Hunian' language by changing the Hawaiian language, and that words such as 'aumakua', which we refer to as the High Self, doesn't actually mean the High Self in Hawaiian.

I've been doing more research today, but it seems the more I read the more confused I become.

I fully intend to continue putting all of my energy into this system, and I have no doubt at all that the results of these techniques you have told me about have happened. I'm just doing my best not to get frustrated right now because part of me wants to just practice this system without acknowledging or caring how 'Hawaiian' it is at all.....unfortunately my desire for answers is too strong to let me do that :-p

Now although Hawaiians are claiming the Huna system has nothing to do with them I don't believe the concept of the 'Huna' prayer, and communicating with the unihipili could have just randomly popped into Mr Brigham or MFL's minds...they had to have got this from somewhere.

I'm definitely going to see what I can get my hands on regarding the Hawaiian culture and legends.

Mahalo nui loa for pointing me in the right direction.

Peace,

Craig
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IMHO it all starts if you ask what is huna, and there is no single valid answer.

Even the original Hawaiian teachings, though they don't like it being called huna - HRI claimed they counted around 2600 (or some other big number) of different schools of "huna" on Hawaiian islands. It was all secret, lineage, family thing, kept away from other influence, thus every family had a kind of different system in fact.

To go back to HRI and Lani. I'm asking for forgiveness if I am wrong, these are not facts but the impression I got from all I read and discussed. Moreover, my English also doesn't allow me to express myself in as subtle manners and differences as I have on mind:

When MFL left, there were few people left, mostly "initiated" only into parts of his teachings, and some of them were not aware of the others. Professor Wingo was asked to take over the main Huna organization. Lani was asked to take over the religious part. They were not aware of each other until much later. Lani claims that MFL's main intention was to make Huna a religion. All other people on the HRI board were against MFL in this issue, and that's why MFL himself never went that way. So that's what Lani does.

(Btw. did you know that there is another Huna church, Huna Life, with members like Arlyn McDonald or James Alexander. They kind of separated from HRI. So there is HRI, which teaches Huna as a metaphysical teaching, Huna Life as a religious teaching, and Lani's organization which is kind of hard-wing religious Huna)

If you would like to know exact account on these issues, I would suggest you contact Kahuna Lani, Vince or Otha Wingo, and James Venable Alexander, directly.

Lani is genuine. Also very dedicated. If you don't understand him, don't worry. I also don't understand many things he says, but I accept him and his way, eventhough my way is different at the moment.

Phil the owner of Masterworks let him post on the forums, and there are very few other posters, so it looks like the board is taken over by Lani. If you don't like what Lani says, simply don't read his posts, there are plenty other good posts, especially in the archives.

I have started to think of huna as a system of metaphysical teachings that MFL invented. The point is that it works, not that it comes from this or that hawaiian lineage etc. Use what works. If you find something that you can use, but that comes from other teachings, use it too. IMHO the original hawaiian teachings were not closed systems in the terms that kahuna would add to it his discoveries, or what information was "channeled" to him from his aumakua. So even if some people are so much concerned about purity (particularly Hawaiian's, but I also fight that feeling myself), there is no such thing IMHO.

Ho'omana I heard, would be a name which Hawaiians would have used if the systems had any name. So IMHO they didn't use that name, but it is kind of near to describe the original system from Hawaiian point of view.

As for Hawaiians that are offended by this system, IMHO these are mostly Hawaiians that have no clue. They are just angry nationalists. The real kahuna can't be even slightly touched by such pettiness. That's also IMHO a good way how to judge a good teacher. People who are good at huna but at the same point angry or hostile towards teachers of different Huna schools (eg. towards Lani, or some of the others that deviate from the standards) don't have their own fixations and complexes resolved.

My approach is to get hands on whatever I can, and use what works for me.

Last edited by huna mind, Jun/13/2006, 9:44 am


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Re: HUNA POLITICS


quote:


The main thing that has confused me is that Lani is stating that MFL invented the 'Hunian' language by changing the Hawaiian language, and that words such as 'aumakua', which we refer to as the High Self, doesn't actually mean the High Self in Hawaiian.



I have read from another source that there were many errors in MFL's way of working with Hawaiian language and his conclusions.

Btw. current Hawaiian changed a lot from the old Hawaiian. Also, current Hawaiian is spoke by only ~200 native and ~2,000 total (Lyovin 1997:258, found in Wikipedia) - eventhough I think this number is higher today, with all the courses around, I think it gives a picture on how hard would it be to decode such a language, if you are working with a language that no one uses, trying to decode teachings that no-one is willing to tell you about.

quote:


I've been doing more research today, but it seems the more I read the more confused I become.



I'm also doing research in similar waters, and I'm confused a lot, too. So I set to better to focus on the practical part, and do the theory only for fun.

quote:


....unfortunately my desire for answers is too strong to let me do that :-p


...we are on the same lurching boat emoticon

quote:


Now although Hawaiians are claiming the Huna system has nothing to do with them I don't believe the concept of the 'Huna' prayer, and communicating with the unihipili could have just randomly popped into Mr Brigham or MFL's minds...they had to have got this from somewhere.



MFL was an avid metaphysical researcher. He was into many things. Eventhough it's not pure Hawaiian, I'm sure it is similar to original Hawaiian. The point again is, to which kind of Hawaiian teachings it is similar. IMHO there were many lineages and all had differing teachings themselves.

Now in the old Hawaii, there were no problems with that, it had no name so no one could argue whether their "huna" is right or others "huna" is right. They also kept their teachings secret from outsiders. So unlike today one person can get Phd in chemistry, mathematics and languages, in Hawaii every Kahuna had just one PhD - from their own lineage.

Last edited by huna mind, Jun/13/2006, 9:46 am


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Re: HUNA POLITICS


Thankyou for your posts Thomas, they have been very helpful indeed.

You know sitting here now, I just realised how amusing it is that I encounter the same kind of politics through my martial arts. I practice Jeet Kune Do, which was devised by Bruce Lee, who researched many martial arts in order to free the individual from one particular style, and be more effective in combat.
There are about three different distinct branches of Jeet Kune Do, and all of the branches claim that their way is the correct way and that the others are wrong (for example the 'original Jeet Kune do' practicioners emphasise the art exactly as Bruce taught it whilst the 'Jeet Kune do' concepts practicioners do not view it as a stlye, but believe in evolving the art, adding their own things...incidentally my school is a cross between the two).

The point I am getting it here is that I stopped worrying about the Jeet Kune Do politics a long time ago. I am aware of it's origins, and I respect them, but I do not see the need to speculate on wether there have been misinterpretations etc, and how it should be today. As long as it works for me, then that is what matters.

Wether we call this 'Huna', Ho'omana, pule me mana, hawaiian mysticism etc is irrelevant I believe...I know that either way, I have found something special, and I look forward to sharing my journey with you all. Aloha nui loa.


Peace,

Craig
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quote:

Thankyou for your reply Two Bears.



You are very welcome.

quote:

The main thing that has confused me is that Lani is stating that MFL invented the 'Hunian' language by changing the Hawaiian language, and that words such as 'aumakua', which we refer to as the High Self, doesn't actually mean the High Self in Hawaiian.



Craig: Everyone is entitled to their opinion including Lani; but here is one time he is wrong. Several years ago; I was surfing E-Bay, and found a copy of a magazine printed in 1898 which had an article by a Hawai'ian, and in this article he talked about his spiritual roots, and he DID give thanks to his 'aumakua 20 years before MFL went to the islands.

quote:

I've been doing more research today, but it seems the more I read the more confused I become.



Congrats. The first step to wisdom is the statement "I do not know". ;-)

quote:

all.....unfortunately my desire for answers is too strong to let me do that :-p



Relax. The answers will come when you are ready for them.

Do not worry about seeking answers; use the system, and prove to yourself that it works. Try manifesting parking spaces, calling up a breeze, punching a hole in a cloud, etc.

There is a radical difference between believing in a system and knowing beyond doubt that a system works.

quote:

system has nothing to do with them I don't believe the concept of the 'Huna' prayer, and communicating with the unihipili could have just randomly popped into Mr Brigham or MFL's minds...they had to have got this from somewhere.



You are quite right about that.

You also have to understand that the idea of the three parts of the soul is NOT only acknowledged in Hawai'i.

That concept is accepted virtually world wide.

The druids had three levels Bard, Ovoid (SP) and Druid, and they used the symbol of the three drops of awen, three standing stones in a circle.

The Celts used the triskelle symbol. a wheel with three curved spokes meeting in the center.

In the book "Lakota Belief and ritual" James R. Walker; documents in his 1898 book that the Lakota acknowledged three parts of the soul. They called them the nagi, nagapi, and tunkashila.

The Mongolian shamans use the name ami, suns and suld.

Jewish kabbalahists talk of three parts of the soul nefesh, ruach, and neshamah.

Taoists have names for the three levels of energy used by a person jing, ch'i, and shen.

If you do the legwork and explore assorted traditions; you will find striking similarities between diverse spiritual paths.

quote:

I'm definitely going to see what I can get my hands on regarding the Hawaiian culture and legends.



I would DEFFINATELY recommend that you start with the huge book by Martha Beckwith, and study the kumulipo. Ms. Beckwith had a smaller volume just abour the kumulipo; but get the big volume; them follow that with the selection of stories compiled by one of the last kings Kalakua.

quote:

Mahalo nui loa for pointing me in the right direction.



My pleasure.

Craig





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quote:

Even the original Hawaiian teachings, though they don't like it being called huna - HRI claimed they counted around 2600 (or some other big number) of different schools of "huna" on Hawaiian islands. It was all secret, lineage, family thing, kept away from other influence, thus every family had a kind of different system in fact.



This is very correct.

There were kahuna who were prayer experts the kahuna pule (the firld that I have focused on), the kahuna aloha, the kahuna that sent sickness and ill wishing, the kahuna ana ana that were the kings assassins via the death prayer, the kahuna who healed with massage (lomilomi, the kahuna who healed by using herbs. I once read there were kahuna who actually did cataract surgery by cutting the cornea andremoving the cataract with a special kind of grass. I do not know if this actually happened; or someone trying revisionist history.

quote:

When MFL left, there were few people left, mostly "initiated" only into parts of his teachings, and some of them were not aware of the others.



From the material that I have read; the Hawai'ians would not talk of spiritual matters with ha'oles for fear of persecution.

Remember in Hawai'i; they made it illegal for the hawai;ians to heal the sick, and once a kahuna was known by he Christian missionaries and their puppets in the governmentl the kahuna was on the way to jail.

quote:

I have started to think of huna as a system of metaphysical teachings that MFL invented.



MFL started with the stories of the kahuna, then people like Reginald Stuart lied to MFL that he had been taught huna concepts in the Atlas Mountains, then MFL merged in stories of the bible (because of a flawed Hawai'ian translation of the bible, Theosophy, and mistakes by using a Hawai'ian dictionary 70 years out of date.

That is why I put my trust in FIRST HAND experience, Hawai'ian legends and culture, abd two authors who actually studied from a living kahuna in the 1950s.

quote:

that you can use, but that comes from other teachings, use it too.



This I have to disagree with. I say do the research, and trust personal experience.

This attitude is one of the few things I have against Allan P. Lewis's book. He used the comment "I use truth where I find it" then he goes on to teach "The middle pillar of the Kabbalah, and the Rose Cross from western occultism.

Cultures all over the world used a meditation similar to the middle pillar.

The druids used a meditation where they visualised sitting in the sunshine, and the sun filling there bidy with light.

Some Buddhists use a meditation called "the being of light. the middle pillar from the Kabbalah,

In India and Tibet; some of the yogis used a meditation called fire yoga (and later Actualism meditation was based on fire yoga.


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quote:

If you have a look at the Bulletin board on masterworks website you will soon see what I mean. There is so much talk about 'Hunian' language, Huna Mua, Ho'omana, cannibalism etc and none of it makes much sense to me.

Now please correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought Huna was Max Freedom Long's interpretation of the practices of the Kahuna Pule (possibly called ho'omana by the ancient Hawiians), and that many Hawaiians are offended by this 'system' because of the Christian influences added by MFL, and because they believed the knowledge should be kept more or less secret to prevent misuse.
I've even heard that native Hawaiians are claiming they practiced, nor believed ANYTHING outlined in the system we call 'Huna'



Most Hawaiians disregard Huna as a new age mythology as demonstrated here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Search?search=Huna&go=Go), but that should take nothing away from Huna as being a respectable religious practice, just not a Hawaiian one. As for the Hunian language you spoke about, it doesn't exist except in a few, short, basic phrases borrowed from the Hawaiian language. There has been extensive discussion between "Kahuna" Lani and me about the subject of the Hunian language at the following links

http://www.masterworksinternational.com/BBoard/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=187

http://www.masterworksinternational.com/BBoard/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=185

http://www.masterworksinternational.com/BBoard/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=91


But each time "Kahuna" Lani who claims to have been working on the Hunian language since 1980 is challenged to provide an example of the language, he flees the discussion with his tail between his legs, or he goes off topic debating silly things about the Hawaiian language, but he never has provided any evidence to substantiate his "Hunian" language.

Keep in mind that I have nothing against Huna or it's teachings, but in the case of "Kahuna" Lani and his self-proclaimed expertise in such a "Hunian language," his fraudulent ramblings deserve to be debunked.

But I'll tell you what, have Lani prove me wrong. Perhaps he would be swayed to attempt to write in his alleged "Hunian language" by other Hunians. If not, all evidence strongly suggests that the language does not exist, or that at least his authority in the language is unfounded.

Last edited by Nero Stylez, Jul/6/2006, 7:37 pm
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quote:

Most Hawaiians disregard Huna as a new age mythology as demonstrated here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huna, but that should take nothing away from Huna as being a respectable religious practice, just not a Hawaiian one.



Technicaly; huna as described by Max Freedom Long; IS a composite.

huna has bits of Hawai'ian mysticism, Christianity, and Theosophy.

the Wicca religion is ALSO a composite (mental mysticism Gerald B. Gardner learned while working as a civil servant in india, Masonic ritual, AND witchcraft.

You are correct; in saying that the Hawai'ian people do NOT like what MFL taught as huna; and I do NOT blame them.

What I teach and practise is NOT strictly huna. You will NEVER see me postulating the half baked ideas of MFL; or any other huna author.

Everything I teach here has come from one of three sources.

1. writings of Clark Wilkerson, or Allan P. Lewis (men who were actually taught by hawai'ian kahunas

2. mystical experiences where I was taught things by my 'aumakua, or one of the gods and goddesses.

3. techniques that I have seen work consistently.

I use the name huna on my website ONLY so readers of other huna books will have a frame of reference to what I am talking about. When I talk about this system I use one of the two terms I coined; pule me mana (pray with lifeforce energy), or spiritual technology.

quote:

As for the Hunian language you spoke about, it doesn't exist except in a few, short, basic phrases borrowed from the Hawaiian language.



I also know kahuna Lani; and I tend to let his ramblings go in one ear and out the other; because a lot of the things he says about MFL just ain't so; and he was not appreciative of the fact that I used MFLs words to refute his claims.

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